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lordandrei

Andrei's Universe

One man's journey from infinity to nothingness


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Andrei in the office
lordandrei

Heroes: Lifted from the comments

On occasion when a thread gets good, I lift the comment up to a direct post and start a new thread. I've been having some wonderful conversations about Heroes with damiana_swan

Below the LJ Cut is her original comment to my post from yesterday



Before I get into the comments I'd like to point out a website that I've been voraciously using. HeroesWiki is a fan created and maintained site that is probably the single best repository I have EVER seen for any television show. This site maintains data on canon, history, theory, spoilers, news. If you haven't seen the site, I strongly recommend it. I'll also be linking heavily to it here.

From yesterday's comments from damiana_swan


I think you're pretty much right about Peter & Nathan, particularly since he would have been busily absorbing every power Sylar had picked up since he killed Peter ... although it's interesting that he never manifested any of them, no?

Peter has displayed abilities that Sylar has used. In "Homecoming" Sylar threw around a lot of Telekinesis which Peter then used in "http://heroeswiki.com/Unexpected". This was one of the early reasons people believed that Peter had to experience the ability in use to acquire it.

A side note... many of the abilities we see are a reflection of not merely the emotional state of the person using it, but to a general makeup of their belief in themselves. Hiro and Niki continually doubted their abilities. Both had to go thru phases of realization and faith to come to terms with their abilities.

I hazard that Ted's ability was also tied to his faith in his ability to control it. His explosion in the Bennet's house was due to anger and fear. By the time Ted is on the road with Matt and Parkman, there is no longer any fear. This seems most true in the case where Sylar flips the vehicle holding Ted and despite being injured and in pain, Ted is in full control.

In "Exploding Man" Peter tells Claire that he is afraid. Peter's fear can only create a feedback loop with Ted's powers. His fear will cause the power to manifest and the manifestation will only cause him to fear it more. This also might explain why Sylar (and his obscene level of confidence) lets him master Ted's powers almost immediately.

Some of my other observations/speculations/questions are:

--I think Angela's power is highly likely to be a subtle persuasion. Note how Claire just meekly handed her phone over (Claire? meek??? a disdainful glare would have been much more in character) even though she *knew* it was almost certainly her father calling. I suspect part of the reason we've been seeing almost a split personality in Nathan--sometimes nice, sometimes nasty and self-centered--is because he's inherently fairly nice but his mother has been shaping him to be, um, more like her all his life. It also looks like she hasn't been bothering much with Peter, except possibly to reinforce his low self-esteem, which would explain not only why he's nicer and less self-centered, but also why his memory is much better than Nathan's. Nathan has a tendency to forget important conclusions, even after he's been bludgeoned with them ... like Linderman attempting to have his wife killed.

I'm really good with this. One thing I hope Heroes does right that Marvel managed to screw up repeatedly.. is that Powers of the generations grow in a line. Marvel has a habit of introducing new character from the past who's far more powerful than anyone currently. Why does this matter? The first season did a lot paralleling evolution and breeding. I like the idea of Angela's abilities being persuasive, but also far less imposing than say Eden's. In Exploding man, Angela was far more obvious about touching people.

I'd also like to hazard that Angela's abilities would be weakest on Claire. I don't say this because of the Blood ties, because (if we assume this is in fact her ability) we see it works far too well on her sons. I think Claire's ability to regenerate to her 'natural form' make it more than likely that anything that would adjust her perceptions, memory, or intentions, would immediately start to shift back.

--Keito Nakamura is Kensei. Not only did he make some very odd remarks to Hiro when he was training him, but the face behind that Samurai's mask looked awfully familiar. And it would also explain why each of the people "the company" was tracking had Kensei's chosen symbol tattooed on them. I *don't* think Hiro is Keito/Kensei; it would require him to be in the same place at the same time way too damned much ... and as anyone who's ever read any science fiction at all knows, that's a baaaaaaad idea. Hmm ... maybe Kensei *started* the company himself and made some unfortunate choices in business partners?

I am not convinced that Kaito is Kensai. I watched the footage a few times in slow motion of the training as well as the reveal of solo japanese warrior. It looks like generic-asian actor. Now granted... I'm guessing at this point the writers may have an inkling but not necessarily the details. This is normal in television fiction. An example can be seen of this when looking at the first episode. The picture of Chandra Suresh on the book is a different actor. Sylar was shrouded in darkness until they decided he was not one of the regulars we'd met and then cast Quinto. okay so much for the technical approach to the topic.

Japanese culture is (like Egyptian culture and to some extend all the ancient cultures) dynastically driven. Thus the Son becomes the Father. (<tone="sarcasm">No, we never see this anywhere in religion</tone>) I think that Kensai is very much a part of the Nakamura history. I think we will see the Godsend symbol originates from this line. I firmly believe without a doubt that there's a LOT more that Kaito knows about everything. I believe that when Kaito speaks of history and what the family has done he speaks in an all encompassing I which symbolizes owning the collective work of his family over the generations.

--What *is* the story behind the whole Nikki/Jessica thing? Obviously they were abused by their father, obviously Jessica died ... but how did they end up sharing the same body, and why hasn't that talent expanded to include other people as well, particularly given Jessica's propensity for causing spirits to, um, become disembodied?

I honestly do not believe that there is anything special about the Niki/Jessica dichotomy. I honestly view it as a divergent personality disorder brought about by childhood trauma. If Niki and Jessica were twins I can easily see a child taking refuge in her mind. Niki would hide from the trauma of abuse by playing with her sister. As her sister took more of the physical abuse (culminating in death) Niki could easily come to see Jessica as the stronger one. (Though, Niki was really the surviver) When her powers manifested it gave her a stronger crutch to rely on her internally created "Jessica" defense mechanism.

Internally Jessica became strength without control to simply make things better regardless of the cost. There was no moral implications. The Jessica personality makes this clear in "Landslide" when she says, "Everything I did, I did for them." (Assumably Micah and Niki) In Landslide, the Jessica and Niki personalities come to realize that Niki is learning what is best for her and doesn't need to rely on her id/impusle to keep her safe. In "Exploding Man" Niki comes to terms with her own strength and takes ownership of her special abilities.

We see after the fight with Candice that when she looks in the mirror ("Mom, is it really you" (Micah asking if it's Candice)) that she doesn't see Jessica. Jessica may now be gone and she may have come into control of her not merely her mind, but her self.

--Who was Sylar's father?

A watchmaker? I really hope that we don't get an 11th hour twist that presents us with the idea that PapaPatrelli slept with Sylar's Mom (Audrey the not Plant). I'd really like to see that Sylar is just another random that popped up. Generations may present us more seeds. Like maybe the watch maker was a potential that they knew about but lost track of.

When you start doing things like "The Cheerleader is actually Nathan's daughter".. you get frighteningly close to Soap Opera where you're waiting more for the surprise plot twist that hoooopefullly doesn't contradict history than the human story which is the driving thing that makes Heroes such a great show.

--Whatever happened to the girl who could send email with her brain? Caught in a spam filter somewhere?

Hana Gitelman was predominantly created for the Heroes360 interactive activities. Her character was designed to be part of the activities that maintained fan interest in the time between episodes. Especially in the seasonal hiatuses. Check out the online comics (graphic novels) at NBC's Heroes' site. HeroesWiki also has a fairly complete biography of her and her interactive activities (linked above in this paragraph at her full name)

--Did Mohinder's sister really die?
I really hope so.

I'm not saying that I'm happy for any character to die. But this is one of those things that would go back to my whole debate about good fiction vs. bad soap opera writing. Chanti's death set in motion many things that were very defining for the character of both Chandra and Mohinder. To take that away would cheapen her death as well as what it stands for.

And anyway... if she's not dead. She's living on an island with Samantha Mulder.


--Where's the Haitian?
I think this may be a much bigger question. Personally, I'd love to find out that he's the man that can look back at Molly. It may have been an oversight. The actor may not have been available... But I think this one may have some bearing on the future.

--Assuming that the "true dream" power is one that Peter absorbed from someone else ... who did he get it from? It seems to have been one of the first he manifested, even before Nathan's. (I don't buy that he got it from Charles; Charles perceived his presence, which is something different.) Maybe that's what his father's power was?

I don't have much here. I think that this is a good working theory. I'd like to go back to the comic and series to see if they ever referred to PapaPetrelli as a "Dreamer."

--And speaking of Charles ... who was Simone's mother, and did she (Simone) have a power? Since she had been "matched" with Isaac and then possibly Peter, I'd tend to think so.

Kring went on record several times stating that Simone didn't have abilities. She was primarily there to motivate the tension between Isaac and Peter. If the Heroes universe is constructed that 'abilties' is a dominant gene that will be passed, then one could hazard that Simone may be adopted.

Claire was an example of placing a special under 'foster care'. Could the door have swung both ways? Might Charles have taken in Simone to get away from the angst of what the company was turning into?

-----------

Personally, I think there is a lot of history to be told yet. I firmly believe that the stories of Linderman, PapaPetrelli, Angela, Kaito, Thompson, Claude are far from over. I am enthused for where the show could go next.



Comments?

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(Deleted comment)
i like the jessica/nikki being a simple mpd issue. Makes sense. the first time the power manifested and nikki did something, possibly brutally murderous, she would have been shocked and denied that it could have been her doing, it must have been jessica, the strong one.

the other possibility i see is that it was a manifestation of jessica's power, she somehow "jumped" into nikki's head before she died. some kind of mind control power say, and perhaps she was taking refuge in nikki's mind from whatever abuse she was being subjected to, thus not being in there to cry 'uncle' before dying, leaving her consciousness behind in nikki's mind when her body died. perhaps further, when jessica is in "possession" of a someone, she has control of their power, meaning nikki was unable to manifest super strength until jessica left, which makes me think she may have jumped into candices head, which kept her from using her illusion power to make nikki's punch miss.
the fact that the tattoo seemed to only manifest when jessica was in control of nikki would lend some credence to this theory, or at least something else beyond just a normal case of MPD

The Nikki/Jessica thing is absolutely a power.

Why?

The tattoo.

Different personalities can't conjure a tattoo at will.

Oh, and Wireless (Hanah) is very likely not in it for the hiatus. Currently, she's riding in a Chinese rocket to get close enough to the satellite Linderman's group uses to track the devices planted by the two-pronged needle guns as part of Bennet's 'bag and tag' program. She can take it down, but only if she's in range.

Last I checked, those Chinese rockets don't necessarily come back down, and the story in the graphic novels is titled 'The Death Of Hanah Gitleman'.

Agree on one correction on the other...

The Nikki/Jessica thing is absolutely a power.

Why? The tattoo. Different personalities can't conjure a tattoo at will.


You know, this had utterly slipped my mind. The manifestation of the tattoo was a strange thing in reference to the character. I really need to ponder this.

Oh, and Wireless (Hanah) is very likely not in it for the hiatus.

I should correct myself. Hannan was designed to help keep users linked in during the season 1 hiatus. I think they decided that she served her purpose for season 1 and wrote her out via the comics as easily as they wrote her in.

Re: Agree on one correction on the other...

And she did a heck of a job during that hiatus. Anyone who followed the graphic novels found out that papa Petrelli had a lengthy history with the good Mr. Linderman, and discovered Linderman's powers long before the show revealed them. That's a first, to my knowledge, for a popular show to reveal major plot points in a venture that never appeared in the series.

I was hoping she'd stay around. She's the perfect character to perpetuate an ARG like Heroes 360, since you can text her, e-mail her, or leave her voicemail anywhere and she can receive it instantly due to her power. Normally that's a huge breach in realism, when a 'real person' somehow responds personally to every message they receive. With Hanah, it's realistic, as it's just a moment's thought for her.

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